Next-Gen Growth Factors

00:04 Trina Renea: Hello, hello. Hi, Rebecca. Welcome back to Facially Conscious. 

00:10 Rebecca Gadberry: Thank you very much. And welcome everybody back to Facially Conscious. We've got such an exciting topic today. 

00:17 Trina Renea: New technology. 

00:19 Rebecca Gadberry: I know, and I think it's where some of the industry is going for the future. It's really exciting. Do you want to just jump right into it, darling?

00:31 Trina Renea: We should. There's so many new things coming out in the world right now with stem cells and all this new research going on in the cosmetic industry. It's just crazy ingredients coming out. It's exciting times. 

And I'm so excited about this particular new ingredient that’s being worked with because it's really changing the skin. It's so exciting to be getting to introduce it to the world here. 

01:06 Rebecca Gadberry: One of the things that I'm excited about with this, and, like you said, there's a whole bunch of new technology out there. Stem cells are actually yesterday’s news. This stuff actually goes beyond stem cells, but it's not a stem cell, what we're about to talk about. 

And the person who's going to be sharing the information with us and educating us today is named Tony Abboud. He and I have known each other for about 20 years. He has got a huge background in biotech beauty. He'll explain a little bit about what that means. 

But 20 years ago, Tony brought me an ingredient that changed the way I formulate. Now, he's taken this ingredient and put some things on the surface of the ingredient to make it super powerful and bring us I think into an area that we haven’t been able to go before with skincare.

Tony is the Chief Commercial Officer for CORE Biogenesis. They're out of France. I think they're based in Paris, aren't they, Tony? 

02:10 Tony Abboud: Yeah, actually Strasbourg, which is just a couple hours outside of Paris.

02:14 Rebecca Gadberry: Okay.

02:16 Trina Renea: Hi, Tony. 

02:19 Rebecca Gadberry: Yes, and Tony is amazing. I just adore him. We're actually working on a project together right now that we’ll share with everybody later. Trina, I know you're interested in this new project, too. 

02:32 Trina Renea: I am. 

02:34 Rebecca Gadberry: So, Tony, tell us a little bit to begin with. What is biotech beauty? What does that mean? 

02:41 Tony Abboud: Yeah. A pleasure to be here, and nice to speak to all the audience for Facially Conscious here. 

Biotech beauty is really about kind of bridging science with skin care. I mean, using wonderful, advanced scientific techniques and technologies to develop ingredients and things that just act on the skin biology. We're not talking about just extracting plant ingredients necessarily. We're talking about really heavy-duty science and things that really activate your own skin mechanisms to rejuvenate and revive your skin. That's what biotech beauty is. 

I’ve been in this field for 20 years, as Rebecca mentioned. It's been only the last coup of years that it's really been sort of buzzy and trendy. Everyone started to really accept it in their new products. So, super excited about where biotech beauty is going in general, and I think we really have a wonderful technology to contribute in this space as well at CORE Biogenesis. 

03:47 Rebecca Gadberry: So what we're actually talking about, everybody, we're kind of being mysterious here, but what we're talking about is something called Growth Factor Technology. Now, for those people who have known me forever, I have never been a big fan of growth factors in skincare. That’s because of work that I didn’t probably 30 or 35 years ago with the 3M Wound Care group that showed that they work, but they don't work on intact skin as well as they do on wounded skin.

I know a lot of people believe that they're fabulous. I'm just not one of those believers, until now. That is because growth factors are very short-lived and they're usually too large to get into the skin. But what Tony's group has done is they've created what we're calling the next generation growth factor technology, where you’ve been able to stabilize the growth factor and lengthen the life of it to months or even years and also help to deliver it through intact skin, through the skin’s barrier. 

For those of you who are wondering, we're no longer in a studio, so that's what that siren was all about.

05:05 Trina Renea: I didn't even hear.

05:07 Tony Abboud: I didn’t hear it. 

05:07 Rebecca Gadberry: You didn't hear it? Oh, my goodness.

05:09 Tony Abboud: It was muffled. 

05:10 Rebecca Gadberry: Okay. So, maybe we can cut that out of the recording. I don't know. If we have it, welcome to the home recording studios.

Anyway, growth factors are amazing. As they sound, they help with the growth of the body. Tony, I know that you’re working with two specific growth factors and they are, you want to tell us a little bit about them and why you chose those?

05:38 Tony Abboud: Yes. Just to continue your conversation, Rebecca, on growth factors and why growth factors, so growth factors have been used since 1995 for skin care. They did start, as Rebecca mentioned, on wound care applications. Growth factors are amazing because these are the proteins that your body naturally produces. And these are the proteins that really activate collagen and elastin production. They build your extracellular matrix. They have all these wonderful inherent tasks and objectives within the body. 

But what happens is, as we get older, as we age, our body stops producing growth factors. And that's one of actually, it's postulated by some dermatologists that that’s one of the root causes of aging, the fact that our body is not making these growth factors anymore inherently. 

So they are these wonderful youth molecules. They have been looked at for 30 years. But, as Rebecca mentioned, they are incredibly unstable proteins. I mean, we're talking about proteins that denature or fall apart within hours. So how are we able to make a serum or a cream that’s supposed to sit on a shelf in a store or it's supposed to be stable in our vanity for months when these proteins literally fall apart in a matter of hours?

Although they have incredible promise and excitement, there just hasn’t been a good technology to stabilize and deliver them into the skin we say until today. 

07:09 Trina Renea: Does that mean all the growth factor products so far in the last 20 years don't work?

07:16 Tony Abboud: That is a very provocative question, I would say. Trina, I would say that they don't. They're not efficient. I think you get some functionality, but they're not effectively stabilized. That's why if you were to do a search of all the publications on growth factors for 30 years, you’re going to find some publications for growth factors work, you’re going to find some publications where growth factors fail.

When you talk to scientists, the reason for that is it's all about the formulation. It's all about how do you stabilize these growth factors. What are the other ingredients that are along with the growth factors in that particular formulation?

So, I would say that they work, but they maybe don’t work as effective as they could work. There's nothing like 100% of your concentration of growth factor in the serum. You might only have 10% or 15%. So there's some left, just not as much as there could be. 

08:14 Rebecca Gadberry: And it depends upon the rest of the formula, like Tony saying. Now, I’ve worked on growth factor formulas for different brands over the last 30 years. Some of them say, “Just put the growth factors in.” There's no stabilization. I'm doing what they're telling me to do. I don't agree with it, but that's what the job is. 

Others will say, “We've got to stabilize it. How do we do that and how do we deliver them?”

What Tony's technology does, the CORE Biogenesis technology does, is they come out of the chute stabilized. When they get to the product or to the manufacturer who's making the product, they're already stabilized. Nothing has to be done extra for the formula. That's one of the big differences here. 

08:55 Trina Renea: Got it, got it. That makes sense. 

08:58 Tony Abboud: Thank you. So I think I'll go back to your original question, Rebecca, which is what growth factors are we focusing on? Probably the most common growth factor right now that's been looked at is Epidermal Growth Factor, or EGF. That's our main ingredient today is based on EGF.

And then we've also done one on Fibroblast Growth Factor 2, or FGF-2. Also commonly referred to as bFGF. 

Both of those growth factors activate slightly different pathways, but at the end of the day, it's all reversing the signs of aging. 

And how we stabilize, so maybe I'll just quickly talk of how we're stabilizing. Like, as Rebecca said, come out of the chute stabilized. We use a powerful delivery system that plants inherently make called oleosomes. And oleosomes are these little tiny spheres that the plant naturally produces in the seeds. 

What we're able to do through our biotechnology process is actually fuse the growth factors to the surface of the oleosome. And we have found that that fused oleosome…ñ

10:04 Trina Renea: Whoa, that's crazy. 

10:06 Tony Abboud: Yeah, and that fusion of oleosome growth factor, we have found in head-to-head studies, it's 10 times more stable than “naked growth factors”,

10:15 Rebecca Gadberry: Not naked growth factors. 

10:17 Tony Abboud: Naked growth factors in quotations, without a carrier. 

And we also found that oleosome growth factors penetrate into the skin deeper. Instead of sitting on the surface where they don't activate the right receptors and the right mechanisms, the oleosome actually shuttles them deep into the dermis and the epidermis where they can actually function effectively. 

That's what we found with these oleosomes that we really bring to the table here. 

10:47 Trina Renea: And how do you stabilize those oleosomes? Or they are the stabilization?

10:50 Tony Abboud: They are the stabilizer. Yeah, they are the delivery system. They basically consist of a phospholipid membrane surrounding plant seed oils and vitamins inside. Then, obviously, you have those growth factors on the outside of the oleosome for delivery. 

11:07 Trina Renea: It's like a possum with its babies and the babies connect to the outside. 

11:14 Tony Abboud: There you go, yeah.

11:16 Rebecca Gadberry: That's a really good metaphor. I think of it as, you know, a liposome we've talked about in the past, and that is kind of like the school bus driving all the kids into the skin. This is like the kids are on the outside of the school bus and they're being driven into the skin.

11:33 Tony Abboud: They're holding on on the outside. 

11:35 Trina Renea: What if they fall off?

11:37 Tony Abboud: Well, they're anchored covalently. And I don't know how to make the right analogy on that, but I guess they're tied to the bus. 

11:47 Rebecca Gadberry: Maybe a magnetic attraction. There's a magnetic attraction between them.

11:53 Tony Abboud: Well, they're not going anywhere. But, yeah, we actually use plants to produce these proteins because oleosomes are only found in plants. They're found in every oil-rich plant species, whether they be sunflower to— we use Camelina sativa. Any oil-rich plant will have these oleosomes naturally within their seeds. 

So, by nature, we have to use this organism as our production method, right? We use plants. And there are a lot of advantages to using plants over other ways to get growth factors. There's sustainability advantages, as well as, of course, this oleosome structure. 

12:35 Rebecca Gadberry: So these growth factors, are they the same as human growth factors? 

12:39 Tony Abboud: Yeah. We use the term “biomimetic”, which means they have the same sequence as the human protein. Amino acid sequence are equivalent. However, they are not made in a human host, meaning they are not made in human cells. They're not made in, you know, they're made in plants. 

13:02 Rebecca Gadberry: No humans are involved. 

13:04 Tony Abboud: No humans were injured or involved in the making of our technology. No. 

So, that's the beauty of biotech is we can use science to produce these biomimetic proteins and then still activate human skin. 

13:20 Trina Renea: And what does it do once it goes into the skin? What is it doing to us and what are the results we're going to see? 

13:29 Tony Abboud: We've conducted two clinical studies, independent clinical studies. The first one was a placebo-controlled clinical study with a third-party lab, 60 volunteers. We found that it basically addresses the four signs of aging in 14 days. So what does that mean? 

The EGF oleosome fusion, which is the first one I talked about, it activates the firming. 

13:51 Rebecca Gadberry: We can use the trade names here, Tony. 

13:55 Tony Abboud: You can. Okay. Well, let me use the trade name. So Peauvita is the EGF oleosome fusion. We found that it improves skin firmness by 21% in 14 days, and it also reduces wrinkles in 14 days. That's the Peauvita.

The Peauforia is the FGF-2 oleosome, and that one we found reduces melanin in areas of hyperpigmentation in 14 days and restores the barrier as well in 14 days. That's why we say it basically addresses the four signs of aging in 14 days or less. It works perfectly.

14:28 Trina Renea: So do you put them together or you buy them separately and put them in different products? 

14:33 Tony Abboud: It's a great question. It's either/or is possible. I would say that about 70% of formulators and dermatologists use them as a complex, so actually together. 

This is a great segue to the second study we ran, which was a retinol head-to-head, or like Rebecca likes to say, a face-to-face study, which is basically a group of people used a retinol at 0.3% and then a group of volunteers used the Peauforia-Peauvita as a complex in a serum. We actually found in our study, the head-to-head or face-to-face, that we reduced wrinkles two times faster than the retinol group. 

15:16 Trina Renea: Where can I get this right now? I'm aging. 

15:22 Tony Abboud: Right now? We'll virtually send it to you and you’ll get the mail later. 

15:26 Rebecca Gadberry: Trina, okay, I'm going to do a little exposé here, because Trina asked that question. She knows darn well she's been using it. Okay. 

So everybody out there, Tony, knows that I formulate. So I've been working with you since probably last November, I think, on a new formula. 

15:45 Tony Abboud: Yes.

15:47 Rebecca Gadberry: And we found some pretty amazing things, too, about this ingredient. We've actually done 10-day studies and gotten remarkable changes in the skin. 

But I've been working on a formula. It's going to be coming out in the middle of November, Tony. Trina is actually going to be offering it under her own name, so she knows when it's going to be available. 

16:10 Trina Renea: You're not supposed to tell that, people. 

16:12 Rebecca Gadberry: I'm kidding. 

16:13 Tony Abboud: I'll tell you, Rebecca, we did the studies, which were great. We got some amazing before-and-afters, and we were excited. But then Rebecca does this amazing formula. Our actives are in there and, I'll tell you, the before-and-afters I saw from her in 10 days were like mind-blowing. They're like life-changing before-and-afters. We're not talking about a small wrinkle reducing by 10%. We're talking like total skin transformation. So it is jaw-dropping. 

16:50 Rebecca Gadberry: We're using these five times the strength of what was in the study. 

16:56 Trina Renea: You’re allowed to do that?

16:59 Tony Abboud: Crank it up. Rebecca is the one that is pushing the envelope here. 

From a safety perspective, it's totally fine. We tested safety at 100% at neat concentrations. It had no sensitivity, no issues. We were just thinking, you know, 1% felt okay, and then Rebecca pushes it to 5% and gets these incredible results. It's got us thinking maybe we should start talking about higher concentrations.

17:25 Trina Renea: You know, I can compare that to lasers, like when the person who's selling you the laser comes to the office, they do it at these low percentages so that you don’t burn someone or whatever. But then it ended up to the dermatologist to push the envelope and turn it up a little more and see how it goes. But they always start low, so that’s kind of like what you’re doing with your testing.

17:49 Tony Abboud: Yeah.

17:49 Trina Renea: Then Rebecca comes along and pushes the envelope then we get, ta-da.

17:53 Tony Abboud: We're like changing people’s skin. Ten days later, their skin is totally transformed. 

17:57 Rebecca Gadberry: I want to bring up the fact that, Tony, you tested against 0.3% retinol, but you were using 1% of the Peauvita and Peauforia. And the reason for that is you can't really use a higher strength of retinol without getting irritation or some kind of a backlash from the retinol. So 0.3 % is the most common percentage for broad use.

With the Peauvita and Peauforia, you not only get better results than the retinols, but you also can use higher strengths without any problem at all. There's no irritation. There's none of the redness that you see with retinol. 

18:40 Tony Abboud: Correct. And that's the beauty of growth factors. We're talking about proteins that our body naturally makes and our body is naturally comfortable with. So all we're doing— And when you look at 1% Peauvita, 1% Peauforia, if you actually look at the growth factor in there, we're talking about parts per million. We're talking about very, very minute doses of growth factor. So although it's 1% of the ingredient, the actual active growth factor there is very, very minute.

But in our original study, we looked at transepidermal water loss or barrier. We found that it was four times more effective than glycerin at building your barrier. So we're talking about an active that’s amazing at anti-aging but also replenishes your barrier. 

I can’t personally use retinol. For me, I turn into a lobster.

19:25 Rebecca Gadberry: Yeah, me too.

19:27 Tony Abboud: I can’t, like I’ve never been able to use it. So, to be able to find something that delivers results without irritation like this, this is amazing.

19:35 Rebecca Gadberry: And the other… go ahead, Trii.

19:37 Trina Renea: I was just wondering, like with its introduction into the market with this, is this like you would take out the retinol and use this instead of, or along with? 

19:51 Tony Abboud: You could replace it completely. You don't need retinol anymore. That's the beauty of retinol replacement. 

19:55 Trina Renea: Wow!

19:56 Rebecca Gadberry: That's blasphemy. 

19:59 Trina Renea: OMG.

20:01 Tony Abboud: Retinol is difficult because, starting in November of this year in Europe, you can only use 0.3% and you have to have a disclaimer on the package. 

20:10 Rebecca Gadberry: 0.3%, did you say? Your microphone glitched. What's the percentage?

20:14 Tony Abboud: Oh, sorry, 0.3% is all you're allowed. 

20:17 Rebecca Gadberry: Okay.

20:18 Tony Abboud: And it needs to contain a disclaimer that says, “High concentrations of vitamin A retinol can lead to…” da-da-da-da-da. I think it's falling out of favor, quite honestly, with a lot of brands, I find. 

20:33 Rebecca Gadberry: There's a lot of retinol alternatives coming out on the market. I think the European requirements are part of it, but I think a lot of people have trouble with retinol. Trina, have you noticed that with people? Yeah, you have trouble?

20:49 Trina Renea: I mean, I switched all my clients from Retin-A to retinol when retinol came on the market. There's been a big push through Retin-A this year and last year that I’ve noticed that they're trying to say, like, Retin-A is the only thing you need to change your skin, like it completely makes you smooth. So the dermatologists are really pushing that retinol is all you need.

But that’s been in the industry forever, so if there's a replacement that’s non-irritating. I have used retinol. Retinols that I currently use are totally non-irritating. You just can’t use them every day, all the time. You have to space them out a little bit. 

Definitely, the world is changing and ingredients are getting better and there's always change, so this sounds like a positive ingredient and a positive change without irritation, which I try to guide everyone towards non-irritating situations for the skin. Because I feel like that kind of ages us the more we irritate it, the more we inflame it through lasers and ingredients and peels and things that aggressively attack the skin in multiple ways. It's like everybody forcing antibiotics into you, all the different doctors, and then we destroy ourselves, you know. 

22:21 Rebecca Gadberry: I think we also need to remember that as we age, as Tony said, our hormones go down, our growth factors go down especially. It's like 10% per decade that they go down. 

What I’ve noticed in our studies that we did, and we kind of did something fun. We did what I call a crowdsource study. We just sent the product out to a bunch of people and they took before-and-afters with their phones. We told them how to do it, how to control the lighting, how to control the angle. And we noticed that the most results, the best results we got were people who were postmenopausal.

At first I'm going, “Well, why would that be?” It's because growth factors go down as estrogen goes down, not just in women, but also in men. So the worst your skin is because of hormonal aging, the more these work for you. I just thought that was crazy.

23:24 Trina Renea: It's amazing. So your ingredients come out of France?

23:29 Tony Abboud: Yeah, they're produced in France.

23:31 Trina Renea: Then they're FDA approved, or they don’t need to be, or you get them over here?

23:36 Tony Abboud: Yeah. Because we're in kind of the topical cosmetic industry, they're all approved for cosmetic use. We have INKEY name, we have all of our technical dossier, all our safety, regulatory all completed. 

It's primarily going to be used by brands, contract manufacturers, formulators, consultants in the industry. 

23:55 Trina Renea: How does the general public get a hold of it, or do they just have to look for those words Peauvita and Peauforia on the ingredient list?

24:03 Tony Abboud: Yeah. We have quite a few brands launching in the next six months. The easiest way will be if the company uses Peauvita and Peauforia trade names, which some companies are, including some of Rebecca's clients as well. You will see “Made with Peauforia,” “Made with Peauvita” right in the label and/or their marketing.

24:28 Rebecca Gadberry: Tony, we're the first on the market, aren't we? We're first to market?

24:30 Tony Abboud: We are, yeah. Yes.

24:33 Rebecca Gadberry: Yipee! 

24:34 Tony Abboud: Rebecca is the first and there will be many to follow. Rebecca always starts trends, so we got to make sure to give it to her first. 

24:38 Trina Renea: I know. It's so nice being on the inner circle. 

24:44 Rebecca Gadberry: And there's a whole bunch of magazine articles coming out about it too. Tony, what was the magazine that came out with it last month? I'm trying to remember.

24:54 Tony Abboud: We've had quite a bit of press lately, primarily business-to-business press, but we were even in New You magazine. We've been in Cosmetics & Toiletries. We have a big technical article in SOFW next month, so we're definitely getting the word out. 

25:11 Rebecca Gadberry: And this is going to just flood the market, I think, at the beginning of the year. I think that’s when most people are coming out.

25:19 Tony Abboud: Yeah, that’s correct.

Going back to retinol, although we're much less irritating than retinol, which is great, we're also a lot faster than retinol. Retinol takes 30 to 60 days, sometimes 90 days to really show efficacy. Nobody wants to wait 60, 90 days anymore. Not a soul wants to wait two, three months. People want to see results in 10 to 14 days, and I think this is a technology that can deliver that without any irritation. I just want to add that in there as well. 

25:48 Trina Renea: Can I ask a tricky question? You can cut it out if you want, Rebecca. 

25:53 Tony Abboud: I love tricky questions. No, you don't have to cut it out. 

25:57 Trina Renea: Can you use this ingredient along with exosomes? 

26:02 Tony Abboud: You can, but this is not an exosome, I would say. 

26:06 Trina Renea: Right. I know. 

26:07 Tony Abboud: I want to make sure that it's stated, that it's on the record that this is not an exosome. Because exosomes are an interesting technology, but that is a nanotech. That's a nano. It can penetrate very deeply, sometimes maybe too deeply. 

Oleosomes are micron particles, meaning they penetrate to the dermis and stop. They don't go any further than the epidermis and the dermis layer. 

Also, the oleosome is delivering growth factors, very specifically growth factors. Exosomes sometimes have a bit of a mixed bag of what it's— you have to really check with your suppliers to see exactly what an exosome is delivering, making sure that it's everything that's good for the skin. 

We like to differentiate ourself from an exosome. It's a cool technology, but we are different. 

26:55 Trina Renea: Got it. 

26:55 Rebecca Gadberry: And we're using in this new formula that we've been talking about, and usually we don't talk about new formulas, Tony, but I'm just so excited about this, and it fits in with what you're talking about so well. But I decided to use an exosome from turmeric because it was originally developed for eczema. It's part of what gives us our anti-reddening element to this product. 

So, there is an exosome in it. It's not a human exosome. It's not one of the standard exosomes. It's kind of a new technology as well. 

27:31 Tony Abboud: Yeah. Very cool. There's definitely a lot of buzz about exosomes these days. It's something you could use in combination or as a replacement, even, if you wanted to. 

27:42 Tony Abboud: Got it. Okay. Thank you. 

27:45 Rebecca Gadberry: We're going to have some before-and-after pictures up on the website, on the blog that's going to post when this podcast posts. And we'll have more written down, we'll have more of a written explanation of what we're talking about, and also on Trina’s Substack. 

So if you want to learn more about this, it's so exciting. It doesn't really matter what part of the beauty area you're in, whether you want to just use it for yourself or you're an esthetician or a dermatologist. These Peauvita and Peauforia are some of the most interesting stabilization technologies that I've seen. 

Tony, what does the future hold for the CORE Biogenesis product development? 

28:36 Tony Abboud: Thank you for the nice words, Rebecca. So the future basically is bright because we're going to be producing all kinds of biomimetic proteins to really act on the human body, whether that be topically or even nutritionally. We're even thinking about using it in a supplement type of technology. We're starting with growth factors but we think there's a lot of other proteins that we can produce in our system, stabilize these proteins, and then deliver amazing results, whether it be inflammation, anti-aging, hair growth, cellulite reduction, nutritional benefits. 

We really do think the future is quite bright for what we're doing. Very different than small molecules and peptides, we think proteins are what's next in skin care. 

29:29 Rebecca Gadberry: Yeah. But stabilized proteins that can get into the skin, because that's one of the big problems we have with proteins.

29:33 Tony Abboud: I agree. 

29:35 Rebecca Gadberry: Proteins and peptides, they're larger molecules and you've got to deal with the skin's barrier.

There was a study I was reading a few weeks ago. I forget where I read it. That showed that 70% of the products that they tested that claim to go through the barrier did not. They just picked them at random. So I don't think that is a good percentage necessarily to really indicate what actually gets through, because I know a lot more than 70% of the products out there do penetrate, but as a random sampling, if you're not trying to deliver an ingredient, it probably won't get through. 

And there's multiple ways to do it. I think the CORE Biogenesis material is a brand new way to do this. And since it can be applied to so many different ingredients, I'm looking forward to seeing what else we're going to be getting from you guys that will help to change the face of the industry as well as the face of all of us out there.

30:42 Tony Abboud: Yeah. Looking forward to coming on maybe in the future and talking about the next launch down the road. 

30:47 Rebecca Gadberry: Absolutely, absolutely. Trina?

30:50 Trina Renea: Amazing. I'm so excited about this. I'm just so excited. I just can't wait to introduce it to everybody. Thank you for creating it. Thank you, Tony, and your crew. 

31:04 Tony Abboud: Yeah. Thank you. 

31:05 Trina Renea: To all your team. 

31:06 Tony Abboud: Thank you so much for having me on and speaking to all your listeners, and looking forward to seeing where this goes in the future. 

31:15 Rebecca Gadberry: Absolutely.

31:15 Trina Renea: Awesome. We'll have you back.

31:18 Rebecca Gadberry: Thanks for taking time to be with us and explain this brand new, awesome technology to everybody. Take care, everyone.

31:27 Tony Abboud: Thank you. Take care.

31:27 Trina Renea: Thank you. Bye.